Talon valve spring retainer setting
Guys,
Just reassembled a TSS valve last night. The spring retainer was already ported and polished. I tried to use a condor high flow spring retainer but the ID was too large for the talon spring I was using and I had nothing to fit it.
Well here’s the question: how many turns should one put on the spring retainer to preload the spring correctly? Once the top of the valve was installed I tightened the spring retainer 1/2 turn past the point were I felt resistance. More turns and the spring felt like something was binding.
TSS is outfitted with a 17.3 in 20 cal barrel and stock hammer with new condor weight. At 3000 PSI first shot was at 922 fps with 14.3 gr CPs.
Sorry did not measure the top hat set point but I was conservative as the top was set were the stem threads were showing.
Regards,
Chimp
All Replies
Viewing 9 replies - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
Chimp,
I’m not sure exactly what you have in your rig. If you like a bit of PW control then a std hammer weight is usually better.
Hey you are right on the money. If things work better at 2800 the way you’re currently set up, that IS the thing to do. Been used for a Looong time. Saves a lot of futzing around.
As a general statement if you want a lot of shots and don’t need or want a lot of power then close down the top hat. You could close it as far as it will go then just play with the PW a bit. You might get a sort of linear drop in fps but you should get a lot of shots.
What have I used in top hat? From 90s to >50. Gets to be too long to relate. I’ve found I can use a wide open top hat and poop shots with light pellets and then turn things up to high power shots heavy pellets with PW. The Condor rig slings them still harder and faster but not by a while lot.
MikeMV,
Thanks – I like the tune-ability at lower hammer weight, but can not get the valve to open at 3K psi -It likes 2800 psi. I also like the reduced hammer recoil and reduced lock time.
Are guys running the setup I have and just filling to 2800 psi? That’s cool I get more fills off the scuba tank.
On your TSS set up what top hat setting are you at? Is 0.051in too low?
Regards,
Chimp
Chimp,
Stock SS parts work fine and better when they are all tuned up so to speak. Pick a mid PW then make adjustments to the top hat.
As a general mention if you use more weight you tend to lose adjustment and power curve.
m
It should be doable, Psion has a similar setup .20, high-flo valve and posted a awesome 35 shot string and he was just peaking on the velocity on shot 35. He still had the other side of the string to shoot. Pretty impressive, i’d PM him to get specifics like tophat setting, hammer weight, pellet used and so on. Your 2,3,4 tests aren’t bad at all, but your after a string like Psion’s, i would be too. With his feedback it should get you close. If you run out of adjustment on the tophat, consider getting a hole punch for paper and cut some ali can material for shims. First thing is to get ahold of Psion1962 because that the nicest string i’ve seen in a good long time. Did you see the post below?
http://talonairgun.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2449
Guys had free time with TSS and ripped these off in several configurations, changing the hammer, PW setting and fill pressure.
All tests were with 17.3 inch 20 cal, ported spring retainer TSS valve, 14.3 gr CPs.
This is fast. I want to tune it down to a bell shape cure starting at 880 -900-800. Yea what a dream. But any hoot what are your suggestions ❓
Thanks!!
Chimp
TEST 1
Top hat 0.051
Power Wheel 0
Hammer TSS+new condor
Start PSI 3000
End PSI 2600
1 978.8
2 971.7
3 977.4
4 979.1
5 977.4
6 979.1
7 977.2
8 969.7
9 960.7
10 961
11 973.4
12 956.6
13 958.4
14 960.4
15 961.3
16 959.7
17 948.7
18 979.6
19 940.4
20 946.2
21 936.4
22 952
Range 43.2
Mean 963.9
TEST 2:
Top hat 0.051
Power Wheel 0
Hammer TSS only
Start PSI 3000
End PSI ?
1 430 failed to open
2 963.8
3 946.1
4 943.5
5 950.1
6 943.1
7 948.3
8 946.9
9 958.1
10 936.1
11 953.1
12 940.3
13 939.3
14 947.8
15 954.3
16 953.4
17 952.4
18 944.5
19 944.6
20 950
Range 22
Mean 948.2
Test 3:
Top hat 0.051
Power Wheel 4
Hammer TSS only
Start PSI 3000
End PSI 2500
1 616 soft shot
2 968.2
3 951
4 955.1
5 952.9
6 955.4
7 948.4
8 945.7
9 943.4
10 947.9
11 948.9
12 943.1
13 945.2
14 944.6
15 940.7
16 937.1
17 937.2
18 934.3
19 933
20 933.3
21 937
22 927.4
Range 40.8
Mean 944.3
Test 4:
Top hat 0.051
Power Wheel 4
Hammer TSS only
Start PSI 3000
End PSI ?
1 930.8
2 940.9
3 939.9
4 942
5 955.4
6 939.1
7 945.3
8 943.7
9 948
10 947.7
11 936.9
12 932.6
13 935.3
14 917.3
15 934.3
16 Trigger Problem
Range 38.1
Mean 939.3
How does the Talon spring compare to Condors spring? Could be you could add the talon spring to the condor valve, take a shot string and see where your at. Might be you could get a curved string vs. high to low string. That would be my preference.
MikeMV
Thanks for the reply. One more question – I want to make this as efficient on air as possible, so should I be using the new condor weight? I guess I have to see if the talon hammer alone opens the valve at 3000 PSI. What are you TSS guys recommending?
Regards
Chimp,
You are in the ball park. std spring will work fine. you screw down until the valve just seats then turn maybe 1/4 more and seal it in place.
good luck
Viewing 9 replies - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
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I’m not sure exactly what you have in your rig. If you like a bit of PW control then a std hammer weight is usually better.
Hey you are right on the money. If things work better at 2800 the way you’re currently set up, that IS the thing to do. Been used for a Looong time. Saves a lot of futzing around.
As a general statement if you want a lot of shots and don’t need or want a lot of power then close down the top hat. You could close it as far as it will go then just play with the PW a bit. You might get a sort of linear drop in fps but you should get a lot of shots.
What have I used in top hat? From 90s to >50. Gets to be too long to relate. I’ve found I can use a wide open top hat and poop shots with light pellets and then turn things up to high power shots heavy pellets with PW. The Condor short rig slings them still harder and faster but not by a whole lot ~10 fpe
Meant to edit 👿 🙄 😀 😀 😀 😀